To sell or to hold on - CSL values

[dave wilkinson]

There is no bubble and it's not gonna burst, people need to except these prices are here to stay. When the 'bubble burst' last time people had to get out of cars quick which had to be discounted to pay the loaned money back. Cars at present are bought with hard earned cash, the people buying them CAN afford them as its toy money.

You'd have to be mad to sell a Csl at current prices as there's still no replacement for similar money.

[Pip1968]

Originally Posted by MCSL

I don't know what's happening with prices atm. So much 'new' stuff is selling at premiums that were previously unheard of. I wonder if there's just too many people with too much money that are desperate to be part of it. The bubble will pop, but how it affects cars like the CSL, I don't know. Personally, and after owning one, I think they are starting to look expensive. Parts are limited, and engine problems are not rare. I bought mine for £32.5k (from memory) and thought it was worth the money at that (50% cost of a 997GT3). Same car today at £60k loses my feeling of value/worth. My money today would be on the 996/997 GT3 (non-RS).

But I think you have missed the boat on the 996/997 GT3 (non RS) and the GT3 RS. I few years ago they were still well above the CSL prices at around £45,000 (GT3)/£65,000 (RS) and then about two years (advent of the non manual 991 GT3) ago jumped to £65,000 (GT3)/£120,000 (RS). There were very few around but once the prices jumped a lot of people decided to cash in and probably could not believe their luck. Personally I think Porsche f##ked up a little with a paddle shift GT3/RS trying to go for a different market. That and the loss of a race proven engine in the Mezger.

Of course there will always be people who like you feel cars have lost "value/worth" once prices jump. See my comment about the sudden jump in people selling once the 996 GT3 went to £65,000. Then there will be others who think there is more price increase to come and do not want to sell short or like many on here would not know what to replace their 'baby' with. I think that unfortunately cars just seem to get bigger and bigger as well as heavier and with more and more nannying electronics. Where are all the real drivers cars gone - ??? What I do not really get is that there is more use/availability of lighter materials - CFRP/ CF and Al yet cars are getting heavier and heavier (M2 1570kg/ M3 e46 1549kg - Google figures).

Pip

[Pip1968]

Originally Posted by dave wilkinson

There is no bubble and it's not gonna burst, people need to except these prices are here to stay. When the 'bubble burst' last time people had to get out of cars quick which had to be discounted to pay the loaned money back. Cars at present are bought with hard earned cash, the people buying them CAN afford them as its toy money.

You'd have to be mad to sell a Csl at current prices as there's still no replacement for similar money.

I am sure there will be some adjustment in prices if interest rates ever climb back up to something around 5% or at least a premium on inflation. Why put your money in the bank when you are losing money in real terms - ? Admittedly it may not be big adjustment. £55-60,000 tied up in a car is a lot of money for most people when you could buy a nearly new M sport and have some money left over.

Pip

[SSS]

Originally Posted by Pip1968

I am sure there will be some adjustment in prices if interest rates ever climb back up to something around 5% or at least a premium on inflation. Why put your money in the bank when you are losing money in real terms - ? Admittedly it may not be big adjustment. £55-60,000 tied up in a car is a lot of money for most people when you could buy a nearly new M sport and have some money left over.

Pip

Definitely worth keeping with the budget on Wednesday making money in the bank worthless

[Cosworth50]

The values have been over done.

Munich legends selling a 92k miles csl means a 92k mile private sale is c.£28-30k. Munich legends are the most reputable dealer that will warranty a car etc.

I don't care what anyone says but a csl at £70k is too dear. A 996 gt3 with true manual box is less for similar mileage so they've just gone too high at present.

lovely, lovely cars but prices have built in the past 12 months beyond expectations and I think they will fall back - plus many are tatty tracked examples.

A 997 turbo at 40k is cheaper, quicker, better badge etc

A new m4 is cheaper and quicker and better interior

If the bubble pops these 70k cars will halve in value very quickly

[nw99]

997 Turbo or M4 aren't limited .
CSL with limited build numbers will not depreciate much from here .
Also the CSL drives better than a 996 GT3 I've owned both.

[shimmy]

Originally Posted by Cosworth50

The values have been over done.

Munich legends selling a 92k miles csl means a 92k mile private sale is c.£28-30k. Munich legends are the most reputable dealer that will warranty a car etc.

I don't care what anyone says but a csl at £70k is too dear. A 996 gt3 with true manual box is less for similar mileage so they've just gone too high at present.

lovely, lovely cars but prices have built in the past 12 months beyond expectations and I think they will fall back - plus many are tatty tracked examples.

A 997 turbo at 40k is cheaper, quicker, better badge etc

A new m4 is cheaper and quicker and better interior

If the bubble pops these 70k cars will halve in value very quickly

can I guess you are still looking

[Cosworth50]

Originally Posted by nw99

997 Turbo or M4 aren't limited .
CSL with limited build numbers will not depreciate much from here .
Also the CSL drives better than a 996 GT3 I've owned both.

It's objective isn't it.

Porsche gt3s are good cars and have always had a premium but now the csl has caught up.

I'd personally choose a Porsche 911 gt3 over a BMW csl or I'd choose a Ferrari f430 for that matter over a csl.

But, I don't have a csl so people would argue I would say this and people with them will talk up prices.

I'd have a csl for c.£30k but at prices as they are now I decided to buy something else that for me I felt was better value.

They are lovely cars so please don't think I'm saying they're not but the value isn't there any more imho.

[Cosworth50]

Originally Posted by shimmy

can I guess you are still looking

I bought something else instead that I felt was better value so no longer looking but still like the cars

[shimmy]

Originally Posted by Cosworth50

The values have been over done.

Munich legends selling a 92k miles csl means a 92k mile private sale is c.£28-30k. Munich legends are the most reputable dealer that will warranty a car etc.

I don't care what anyone says but a csl at £70k is too dear. A 996 gt3 with true manual box is less for similar mileage so they've just gone too high at present.

lovely, lovely cars but prices have built in the past 12 months beyond expectations and I think they will fall back - plus many are tatty tracked examples.

A 997 turbo at 40k is cheaper, quicker, better badge etc

A new m4 is cheaper and quicker and better interior

If the bubble pops these 70k cars will halve in value very quickly

trouble is, judging a cars value on it's speed or style of interior or even he badge isnt necessarily the best way to judge its value. the older they get, the less all that matters

ive no idea if prices will crash or not but what i do know is there are very few recent cars that have limited numbers and stick in the memory and desire of so many previous owners way after they have managed to go through a whole list of porsches, ferraris, etc. That sort of following sticks and grows as word develops. Im willing to bet that the CSL becomes the most sought after and valuable production car ever made by BMW loing after the F80 is used as a taxi, the 997turbo is the fav or every Luton bad boy and the E30 has rusted into the ground